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Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

  • 1.  Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    Posted Wed January 10, 2024 07:04 AM

    Hi,

    Are the limitations on accessing tape drive attached to VIO server and shared over virtual SCSI still the tape ?

    The article here describing the usage on Power10 still lists DAT320 as the only supported model.



    ------------------------------
    Zaki Jääskeläinen
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  • 2.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    Posted Thu January 11, 2024 06:15 AM

    The tape device exported over vSCSI will list as tape device only on client.

    The restrictions that are mentioned in the link, still apply.



    ------------------------------
    RUPESH THOTA
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  • 3.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    Posted Thu January 11, 2024 05:20 PM

    Thank you. So 4mm 160/320 GB DAT is still the only supported type of tape drive. 

    I assume this limited support applies to AIX and Linux as it seems IBM i on Power have a much more generous

    support for VIO-attached tape drive models as per this page.

    I have a customer with an SAS-attached external LTO drive connected to a full system AIX LPAR on Power8 now

    migrating to a fully virtualized LPAR on Power10. I will inform him that the drive will not be usable on AIX.



    ------------------------------
    Zaki Jääskeläinen
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  • 4.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    IBM Champion
    Posted Fri January 12, 2024 10:31 AM

    It may be usable (it frequently is), however it won't be supported.  The next step is either a fiber-connected drive or a SCORE/RPQ request.


    From the SSIC page:

    Request for Price Quotations (RPQ)

    If a desired configuration is not available for selection in the above search interface, a SCORE/RPQ should be submitted to IBM requesting approval. To submit a SCORE/RPQ please contact your IBM Representative.
    For IBM and Business Partners only - <slot style="box-sizing: inherit;">Click this link to open SCORE request</slot><slot name="icon" style="box-sizing: inherit;"></slot>



    ------------------------------
    José Pina Coelho
    IT Specialist at Kyndryl
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  • 5.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    Posted Mon January 15, 2024 05:24 AM
    Edited by Juergen Maehlmann Mon January 15, 2024 05:46 AM

    Hi Zaki,

    Were using on dual VIO setup two additional FC-Devices for tapes.

    Per VIO :2 x vSCSI and 2 x Fiber channel device

    The LPAR get's:

    ===SNIP===

    for i in 0 1;do echo fscsi$i;lsdev -p fscsi$i;done    
    fscsi0
    rmt0     Available 25-T1-01    IBM 3580 Ultrium Tape Drive (FCP)
    rmt1     Available 25-T1-01    IBM 3580 Ultrium Tape Drive (FCP)
    sfwcomm0 Available 25-T1-01-FF Fibre Channel Storage Framework Comm
    smc0     Available 25-T1-01    IBM 3584 Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    smc1     Available 25-T1-01    IBM 3584 Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    fscsi1
    rmt4     Available 26-T1-01    IBM 3580 Ultrium Tape Drive (FCP)
    rmt5     Available 26-T1-01    IBM 3580 Ultrium Tape Drive (FCP)
    sfwcomm1 Available 26-T1-01-FF Fibre Channel Storage Framework Comm
    smc2     Available 26-T1-01    IBM 3584 Library Medium Changer (FCP)

    ===SNAP===

    Inside the LPAR we use Atape .driver - IBM AIX Enhanced Tape and  Medium Changer Device Driver, giving us 64 additional tape-devices, incl. tape medium changers.

    This is the current listing by using lsdev -P -c tape -F "type subclass description":

    3490E    fcp   IBM 3490E Tape Drive (FCP)
    3555     fcp   IBM 3555 Tape Medium Changer (FCP)
    3570     fcp   IBM Magstar MP Tape Subsystem (FCP)
    3570L    fcp   IBM Magstar MP 3570 Library Tape Drive (FCP)
    3573     fcp   IBM 3573 Tape Medium Changer (FCP)
    3575     fcp   IBM Magstar MP 3575 Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    3576     fcp   IBM 3576 Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    3577     fcp   IBM 3577 Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    3580     fcp   IBM 3580 Ultrium Tape Drive (FCP)
    3581     fcp   IBM 3581 Tape Medium Changer (FCP)
    3582     fcp   IBM 3582 Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    3583     fcp   IBM 3583 Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    3584     fcp   IBM 3584 Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    3590     fcp   IBM 3590 Tape Drive and Medium Changer (FCP)
    3592     fcp   IBM 3592 Tape Drive (FCP)
    3592V    fcp   IBM 3592 Virtual Tape Drive (FCP)
    C06-PT   fcp   IBM C06-PT Virtual Library Medium Changer (FCP)
    LTO      fcp   LTO Ultrium Tape Drive (FCP)
    hpec     fcp   HPE Tape Library Medium Changer
    ost      fcp   Other FC SCSI Tape Drive
    scalar   fcp   Quantum Tape Library Medium Changer
    scsd     fcp   FC SCSI Tape Drive
    zerzura  fcp   HPE Tape Library Medium Changer
    ost      iscsi Other iSCSI Tape Drive
    scsd     iscsi iSCSI Tape Drive
    3555     sas   IBM 3555 Library Medium Changer (SAS)
    3572     sas   IBM 3572 Library Medium Changer (SAS)
    3573     sas   IBM 3573 Library Medium Changer (SAS)
    3576     sas   IBM 3576 Library Medium Changer (SAS)
    3580     sas   IBM 3580 Ultrium Tape Drive (SAS)
    3584     sas   IBM 3584 Library Medium Changer (SAS)
    LTO      sas   LTO Ultrium Tape Drive (SAS)
    ost      sas   Other SAS Tape Drive
    scalar   sas   Quantum Tape Library Medium Changer
    scsd     sas   SAS Tape Drive
    3490E    scsi  IBM 3490E Tape Drive
    3490F    scsi  IBM 3490F Tape Drive and Medium Changer
    3555     scsi  IBM 3555 Tape Medium Changer
    3570     scsi  IBM Magstar MP Tape Subsystem
    3570L    scsi  IBM Magstar MP 3570 Library Tape Drive
    3573     scsi  IBM 3573 Tape Medium Changer
    3575     scsi  IBM Magstar MP 3575 Library Medium Changer
    3576     scsi  IBM 3576 Library Medium Changer
    3580     scsi  IBM 3580 Ultrium Tape Drive
    3581     scsi  IBM 3581 Tape Medium Changer
    3582     scsi  IBM 3582 Library Medium Changer
    3583     scsi  IBM 3583 Library Medium Changer
    3584     scsi  IBM 3584 Library Medium Changer
    3590     scsi  IBM 3590 Tape Drive and Medium Changer
    7212     scsi  IBM 7212 Tape Medium Changer
    7331     scsi  IBM 7331 Tape Medium Changer
    7332     scsi  7332 4mm Auto Loader SCSI Tape Device
    7334     scsi  IBM 7334 Tape Medium Changer
    7336     scsi  IBM 7336 Tape Medium Changer
    7337     scsi  IBM 7337 Tape Medium Changer
    LTO      scsi  LTO Ultrium Tape Drive
    hpec     scsi  HPE Tape Library Medium Changer
    ost      scsi  Other SCSI Tape Drive
    scalar   scsi  Quantum Tape Library Medium Changer
    scsd     scsi  SCSI Tape Drive
    zerzura  scsi  HPE Tape Library Medium Changer
    0806500c usbif Other USB Tape Drive
    ost      vscsi Virtual Tape Drive
    scsd     vscsi Virtual Tape Drive

    regards,

    Jürgen



    ------------------------------
    Juergen Maehlmann
    ------------------------------



  • 6.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    IBM Champion
    Posted Mon January 15, 2024 08:29 AM

    Virtual fiber channel is the way to go.  I have VIOS supporting my LTO7 VTL to multiple lpars of IBM i and they can backup at the same time.



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    Robert Berendt IBMChampion
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  • 7.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    Posted Mon January 15, 2024 08:43 AM

    Hi Robert.

    Zaki needs the use on  AIX, not on "IBM i".

    Additional info for Zaki.

    Tape devices will be reserved by LPAR as soon as they are in use and released afterwards.

    This means, that you possibly will have to present additional drives to the LPAR from SAN-Side, to be able to do backups in time.

    regards,

    Jürgen



    ------------------------------
    Juergen Maehlmann
    ------------------------------



  • 8.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    IBM Champion
    Posted Mon January 15, 2024 08:53 AM

    I'm pretty sure that VIOS would have no problem with virtualizing FC tape to AIX either.  Honestly we just do not use tape (physical or virtual) on the AIX lpar we have.  It solely supports IBM Storage Protect and we use alternative methods for protecting that data.



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    Robert Berendt IBMChampion
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  • 9.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    Posted Mon January 15, 2024 10:57 AM

    My Power8 customer has an external SAS-attached LTO drive connected to a full system AIX LPAR.

    He is using it for OS and application backups.

    The new Power10 server has a SAS adapter assigned to VIO which would connect the LTO drive and then this assigned through virtual SCSI to a fully virtualized AIX LPAR. (Fully virtualized as the application he is running on AIX is only supported on AIX 7.1.) According to the two pages I linked the support for this is very limited in AIX (SAS- or USB-attached DAT320 only) while IBM i supports a range of LTO and DAT drives.



    ------------------------------
    Zaki Jääskeläinen
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  • 10.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    IBM Champion
    Posted Mon January 15, 2024 12:15 PM

    Does he have any fiber channel adapters available?  And a FC tape drive?



    ------------------------------
    Robert Berendt IBMChampion
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  • 11.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    Posted Mon January 15, 2024 12:56 PM

    Sorry, no. Only the SAS-attached LTO drive.

    Even if connecting this to the AIX 7.1 LPAR on Power10 over virtual SCSI works, relying on this unsupported configuration for system backups sounds unwise. I suspect there is a reason for the limited support on AIX (tested in the lab and found not reliable enough?) The pain will be experienced the day a restore is required...

    I will discuss options with the customer. LTO over virtual FC if he has more money to spend. USB mass storage assigned as virtual SCSI for less money. Otherwise mkdvd backups to virtual optical media repository and dump this to the SAS LTO drive natively on the VIO server. 



    ------------------------------
    Zaki Jääskeläinen
    ------------------------------



  • 12.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    IBM Champion
    Posted Mon January 15, 2024 01:14 PM

    Well, if you are in the market for a new tape system you might want to consider a VTL or Virtual Tape Library.  We have two data centers.  Each has their own Power System(s).  Each also has their own VTL.  The cool part is that the VTL's replicate the 'tapes' to each other.  No dealing with Iron Mountain to make sure that someone takes a tape offsite, etc.  We've done full system restores with the boot done from one of the VTL tapes.

    Disclaimer:  I do NOT make, sell or otherwise make any financial gain from VTL systems.  Just a happy user.  We got rid of physical tapes years ago.

    In any case, shoot for the moon.  If you miss you'll land among the stars.

    If you propose a new FC attached VTL emulating a LTO with offsite replication and they don't bite, they'll think that a new FC attached LTO tape library is cheap.

    IBM tape libraries.  You might be quite happy with a 4300  https://www.ibm.com/tape-storage?mhsrc=ibmsearch_a&mhq=tape%20library

    We're using a Data Domain 6900  https://www.dell.com/en-us/dt/data-protection/powerprotect-backup-dd-appliances/powerprotect-dd-backup-appliances.htm



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    Robert Berendt IBMChampion
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  • 13.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    IBM Champion
    Posted Tue January 16, 2024 04:50 AM

    Yes, 90% of the time "supported" has nothing to do with actual functionality, it's just about having been tested in the lab.

    The large volume of system/firmware/initiator/target/os/vios/san combinations gives you a somewhat sparse matrix of things like USB/SAS Tape over VSCSI.  Also, SAN-based tests are probably easier to setup via automation (it's just a matter of zoning).



    ------------------------------
    José Pina Coelho
    IT Specialist at Kyndryl
    ------------------------------



  • 14.  RE: Tape over VIO Server Virtual SCSI ?

    IBM Champion
    Posted Tue January 16, 2024 06:56 AM
    Edited by Satid Singkorapoom Tue January 16, 2024 07:01 AM

    Dear Zaki


    >>>> Even if connecting this to the AIX 7.1 LPAR on Power10 over virtual SCSI works, relying on this unsupported configuration for system backups sounds unwise. <<<<

    In addition to Jose's post above, I would like to add my 2 cents here.

    In my long professional experience with Power Systems and its predecessors (mostly with IBM i) with many customers in my geography, I observed that the matter of using only "supported" implementation was, in some cases, unduly over-emphasized and caused some customers missed opportunity. 

    I myself would want to always used "supported" method for any thing that is considered complex implementation, for example, I would strictly use only supported implementation for VIOS vNIC Fail-over without any deviation as it is not a simple thing to deploy.  But when the matter is relatively more straightforward (like this case of using virtual tape for straightforward manner of data backup), I noticed that quite a few customers that I was involved with could go with "unsupported" implementation without any problem after I helped them do some experimentation.

    In your case, if the tape is intended to be used without additional fancy features, I would say deploying basic experimentation approach to the matter can be helpful. This means I would suggest that you follow the instruction provided here: Configuring Virtual Tape on Virtual I/O Server at  https://www.ibm.com/support/pages/configuring-virtual-tape-virtual-io-server to see if it works for your case or not.  If so, try doing the data backup as an experiment and monitor any job/system log of the operation to see if there is any relevant anomalous warning or error or not and if the performance is OK with you or not and repeat the experiment a few times over a few days.  If there appears no anomaly at all in the observed OS log in those experiments and the resulting performance is acceptable to the customer, you get experiential data that should provide assurance that this virtual tape from VIOS would work fine.  

    But if you see that there will be any additional advanced feature(s) used in this data backup that warrants the case to be considered complex, then I would agree not to do this experiment and go for more assured alternatives.       



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    Chance favors only the prepared mind.
    -- Louis Pasteur
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    Satid S.
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