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Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

  • 1.  Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Mon October 14, 2024 12:20 AM

    Hi, 

    Does all Ibm i related tools like RDi, ACS, VS Code, mochasoft and rest other connection (jdbc, odbc, ms access etc.) Work well on Apple's laptop like they work on Windows machine? 

    Is it safe to buy Apple's laptop for all Ibm i related tasks like on Windows based laptops? 



  • 2.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Mon October 14, 2024 05:50 AM

    Hi Jerry,

    I'm using Apple devices from long time ago and I have not any issue with the IBM i.

     

    I'm more in the systems side but I'm able to use all the tools without problems.

     

    For me, no difference vs Windows laptop's

     

    Best Regards

      

    -------------------------

    Andreu Rul

    CTO

    Telf: +34 663 817 144

     

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  • 3.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Mon October 14, 2024 11:28 AM

    Hi Jerry

    I can't speak to all of what you listed, but I know ACS will work fine  - just follow the install specific instructions related to installing ACS on a Mac.



    ------------------------------
    Rich Malloy
    ------------------------------



  • 4.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Mon October 14, 2024 02:27 PM

    Hi Jerry,

    I was using Mac for couple of years before and i didn't remember of any issue encountered.  It should work fine as all tools are officially certified for Mac as well.



    ------------------------------
    Rohit Chauhan
    Senior Technical Specialist
    Norway
    ------------------------------



  • 5.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Mon October 14, 2024 09:20 PM
    Edited by Satid S Mon October 14, 2024 09:24 PM

    Dear Jerry

    Please be aware that some part of the answer to your question must come from yourself as it has something also to do with how much knowledge you have about using Apple OS as well as how many features of the products you asked about that you will sue - the more features you use, the more chance you may run into some issues.  For example, if you search past posts in this group, you will see a few posts about stability problem with using 5250 emulation in ACS running in Apple.  I responded that the stability issue may have come from not having proper JDK in Apple (as opposed to using JRE in Windows). 

    As for VS Code, you know that it is Microsoft product and, in all practicality, would you expect that MS developers of VS code would spend the same amount of time and effort on developing it on Windows as on Apple?     The products you asked about may now run on open platform basis but this is only just a principled aspect, you need to take practical aspects into consideration as well. 



    ------------------------------
    Satid S
    ------------------------------



  • 6.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Tue October 15, 2024 03:07 AM

    Hi Jerry,

     

    as one of the others already said with IBM ACS you need to use OpenJDK 11 or OpenJDK 17 and it works fine on Mac.

    With RDi there are some issues which are really strange and known. We hope they will be fixed soon.

    For example the cursor sometimes will be shown one column to the right of it's real position.

    This is sometimes frustrating.

     

    With VS Code you won't have any issues because VS Code is not a Windows product as one mentioned.

    It is an Electron App. That means it is written in Javascript and published with the Electron Framework which runs on Linux, Mac and Windows.

    Windows is the worst platform for this so with VS Code you will be better on Mac and Linux 😉

    We are just working on several add ons for Code4i so VS Code and Code4i will be better than RDi...

     

    Mochasoft I didn't use yet so I can't tell you if it works and if yes how.

     

    If you use the IBM I PASE environment you are much better on the Road with a Mac than with Windows because Mac OS is also Unix based so you can directly connect via ssh, sftp and so on and have some kind of "native" feeling.

    With Windows you should use the Windows Subsystem for Linux and a installed Linux distribution like Ubuntu to have the same effect.

     

    Kind regards

    Markus

     

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 7.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Tue October 22, 2024 03:02 AM

    2 contradictory points here :

    1) Windows is Microsoft's product

    2) VS  Code cannot be supported on apple's laptop compared to Windows laptop?

    3) What about DB2 for i?







  • 8.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Tue October 22, 2024 03:32 AM

     

    Hi Jerry,

     

    I am not sure if these are some follow up questions or the old – so to be sure everything is clear:

     

    2 contradictory points here :

    1) Windows is Microsoft's product

    2) VS  Code cannot be supported on apple's laptop compared to Windows laptop? 

    3) What about DB2 for i?

     

     

    1. Yes – Windows is Microsofts product
    2. VS Code runs perfectly on Apple Mac OS – from my perspective it runs better on Mac OS and Linux than on Windows because it is an Electron based App which means it is a Javascript App that is "converted" into a Desktop App (by the way – Micrsoft Office works the same way these days)
    3. DB2 for i runs on IBM I OS on the IBM POWER Server.
      To access it you can either use the IBM ACS which runs on Java and so it also works on Apple Mac.
      You can also use VS Code with the Code4i Add On which also works on Apple Mac.

     

    As mentioned in my other response you can also use the RDi but it has some issues on Apple Mac that are not appearing on Windows (at least in my team where we are 5 developers using RDi on Windows and 8 developers using RDi on Mac).
    These issues are annoying but not a show stopper. So you use and work with it on Mac.

    I hope that these issues are fixed soon. I am in contact with Steve Ferrell from Fortra who is the Principal Software Engineer Lead RDi.

    The more developers use Apple Mac the sooner such things are fixed 😉

     

     

    Hope that makes everything more clear.

     

    Kind regards

    Markus

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 9.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Tue October 22, 2024 05:44 AM
    So to avoid any risk is it safer to be on Windows based laptop only to run all these software ? 






  • 10.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Tue October 22, 2024 05:49 AM

    Hi Jerry,

     

    if you use the Computer „only" for classical IBM I development like RPG and therefore use the IBm RDi most times, Windows is maybe better.

    If you are also using other stuff like Node.js, Python, Web Frameworks and so on I would suggest to use a Mac.

    In my Team the most people choose Mac and even the ones who never had one won't miss it anymore .....

     

    So it is up to you 😉

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 11.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Wed October 23, 2024 12:23 AM
    Edited by Richard Schoen Wed October 23, 2024 12:26 AM

    The Mac works great for all the items you mentioned.......Except:

    I don't know RDi status on the Mac. I couldn't get RDi 9.6 to work on my Mac M1.

    I also couldn't get RDi it to work in Windows 11 ARM64 on Mac via Parallels, but maybe that has been fixed.

    Microsoft Access will probably work in Windows 11 ARM64 on Parallels but I haven't tested it.  I don't think there's a native Mac equivalent to access unless you install something like LibreOffice perhaps.

    I also have a Windows 11 ARM64 Snapdragon PC, but I can't get RDi to work there either

    If you use RDi and Access a lot (Definitely an interesting combination), then you may need to consider sticking with an Intel based Windows 11 laptop or desktop. 

    It all depends how far out of your comfort zone you're ready to step.......

    Another option is use RDP to your Windows machine while getting used to the Mac. Then life still feels Windowy most of the time.



    ------------------------------
    Richard Schoen
    Owner/President
    MobiGoGo LLC
    Minneapolis MN
    612-315-1745
    ------------------------------



  • 12.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Wed October 23, 2024 02:25 AM

    Hi Richard,

     

    as already mentioned RDi works with the mentioned issues on Mac.

    9.8 can be installed without any problems.

    9.6 need to be installed with special instructions that can be found on the IBM pages (need to look for them if you need them).

     

    Windows 11 for ARM works also with Parallels and with IBM ACS but the used Java version is very important 😃

     

    You need to use the OpenJdk Java 11 or 17. These work. Others won't.

    Same on the Mac.

     

    I tested Oracle Java 17 – had a lot of problems (keyboard won't work for example – not good in 5250 😉 ).

    With OpenJDK 17 everything works fine with ACS.

     

    Because RDi has it's own Java included it doesn't matter which version you install but it also works on Windows for ARM (no Matter on which machine – native or Parallels). BUT – RDi 9.8.

     

    Hope that helps.

     

    Kind regards

    Markus

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 13.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Thu October 24, 2024 01:23 AM

    So overall its  risky to run RDi and VS Code and Ms Access  on Apple's macbooks and other softwares which usually runs without any issues on windows ?

    As on Windows I think mostly all software runs well without any issues or additional set up etc.







  • 14.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Thu October 24, 2024 01:38 AM

    Hi Jerry,

     

    1. VS Code runs better on Mac than on Windows
    2. IBM ACS (Access Client Solutions) runs without any problems (at least the same) when you use OpenJDK 11 or OpenJDK 17
    3. RDi has some issues like the cursor problem I mentioned which should be fixed now. Another thing is that some Plug Ins like for example X-Analyze are only running on Windows. So if you use that, you should use Windows

     

    So no – not everything is better on Windows.

    Therefore Microsoft created the Windows Subsystem for Linux which runs Linux on Windows because also Microsoft knows that a lot of things run better on Unix based systems like Mac Os, Linux, etc..

     

    So if you use IBM i a lot with PASE Products like Node.js, Python, git, bob, Postgre or other stuff, you run better with a Mac.

     

    I hope that makes everything clear. If not you are very welcome to ask.

     

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 15.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 02:36 AM

    And for AI/ML and  for over all coding ,programming  related projects whichone is better Windows or Mac ?

    Also for other factors like graphics,sound picture quality battery life and free software versions (upgrade facility),compatibility with open source related projects and other free softwares (which are available  on Google for free download) whichone will be better here (overall) ?

    Thanks..




  • 16.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 03:42 AM

    Hi Jerry,

     

    here is the answer very clear:

     

    Mac is better for the mentioned topics – from my perspective and the perspective of my Development Team which is exactly doing what you listed.

    If you use Windows for that you should use Windows Subsystem for Linux – Microsoft invented it (something like PASE within IBM i) to run real Linux "inside" of Windows and mix both.

     

    BUT

     

    If you use x86 / x64 Hardware, then you will have much more power consumption which leads to a much more working fan because of the head and your battery will not last as long as with ARM Hardware.

    If you use ARM Hardware with Windows (Windows 11 for ARM like on the Snapdragon Copilot+ PC's) you will have much better performance and less power consumption but more problems with things like IBM ACS and RDi (as mentioned in the other responses).

    Also x86 / x64 Windows Software (which is still the most used) will run not as fast because it will be emulated or it doesn't work at all on these Windows PC's.

     

    So from my perspective if you are working in a "mixed scenario" with classical IBM i stuff and the actual things like AI related topics (Python, Node.js, Langchain and so on) you run best on Mac.

     

    My MacBook Air has no fan at all.

    My MacBook Pro has one but I heard it only 3 times in the past 3 years and that was not very long and not really loud.

    On my Windows Notebook with Intel core i7 12th generation the fan is starting very loud when I boot the Notebook... .

    My Tinnitus is really "happy" with that noise.

    One of the most important arguments to me to use a Mac.

     

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 17.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 04:31 AM

    So how about apple macbook m1 (8gb ram and 256 gb ssd) will it sufficient  for all these tasks?




  • 18.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 04:41 AM

    Hi Jerry,

     

    no – not at all.

     

    You should use at absolute Minimum a Macbook with 24GB RAM and 512GB SSD.

    Better is 32GB or 38GB (M3 Macbooks can have that amount) or more of course....

     

    The Harddisk depends on what you want to save locally of course...

     

    The processor can be a M1. M2 or M3 are faster of course but M1 is already very fast.

    Next week everyone expects that Apple will announce the M4 Macbooks so you should wait a few days. Normally the older devices getting cheaper then.

     

    If you want to run LLM Models locally you need at least 64GB RAM for the smaller Models. Normally you should use a Server for that.

     

    For using IBM i classical  stuff (ACS, RDi, VS Code with Code4i) a 16GB RAM System with 256GB Harddisk is quite good.

     

    Hope that helps

    Markus

     

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 19.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 05:13 AM

    One additional tip - if you configure a new MacBook or Mac mini (also a real good machine) try to think ahead. 

    Todays Apple Silicon Macs aren't expandable anymore - so you have to choose the right dimensions for SSD and RAM right from the start. 

    And - choose wisely - because those Apples tend to live long ... very long. My last iMac lived about 8 years, as my primary developer machine - using Xcode and more. My Mac mini today is already about 3 years old, and still so fast, that I don't have any need for any upgrade. But in both cases this was, because I had chosen a rather large configuration - especially RAM.

    HTH

    Daniel



    ------------------------------
    Daniel Gross
    ------------------------------



  • 20.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 06:38 AM

    Any Amazon link to buy it online with 128 gb RAM  m3 max.

    Also in lesser price Windows laptop whose RAM could be expanded up to 128 gb ,which option will be better here?(any Amazon link for the same?)

    Thanks...




  • 21.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 07:10 AM
    Hi Jerry,

    AFAIK you won't find that maxed out MacBook Pro M3max 128GB RAM configuration at Amazon. At the Apple Online Store it will cost between 4,500 and 5,000$ - I think the build this config only on demand.

    An expandable Windows notebook will most probably be less expensive. And you can buy it now, with a smaller config and upgrade it later, when needed. But on the other side, it definitely won't last that long.

    If you don't need the mobile option, the Mac mini is a very good start - it's the "bring-your-own-display-mouse-and-keyboard" Mac.

    Regards,
    Daniel




  • 22.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 07:50 AM

    I purchased my 13" Air M1 in 2020 during the pandemic with 16gb and 1tb of disk and it's still running strong. I love it. And it's still faster then I need most days. 

    Seems the new M4's will finally be coming out with 16gb base. (about time).

    Marcus point on 24gb seems to be solid, but there is also an M3 that comes with 18gb based as well.

    If you're looking at a 3-5 year time horizon, buy at least 512-1tb of disk and 16+ for memory.  I still try to keep my spend on a new machine in the $2000 and under range. 

    OWC (https://www.owc.com/) and others often have used deals and Best Buy has open box deals often as well. 

    I think for battery life and overall flexibility a Mac is the way to go. 

    To be fair there will be a learning curve. It will take you a little while to get used to MacOS. 

    I'm still learning something new each day after 11yrs using Macs. 

    Same with Windows though. 

    So if you're afraid of change stick with Windows. 

    If you want to widen your horizons, have awesome battery life, do more Unix-ish style stuff and want a keyboard and track pad that just feel awesome, then move to Mac. 

    I still use both, but my daily drivers are Mac machines. And I RDP to my Windows machines when I need a Windows 11 fix :-)

     



    ------------------------------
    Richard Schoen
    Owner/President
    MobiGoGo LLC
    Minneapolis MN
    612-315-1745
    ------------------------------



  • 23.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 08:08 AM

    Hi all,

     

    of course Daniel is right.

    If you don't need it mobile you should also look for the MacStudio which can be explanded to 192GB but you should wait a few days until the M4 Macs are announced.

    Normally the older will be cheaper.

     

    And as Daniel mentioned, you can use the Mac normally much longer and if you combine it with iPhone you will also save a lot of time which cost money as we all know 😉

     

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 24.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 08:34 AM

    How about 13" screen for Apple Air M1  does green screen for coding in ibm i acs,rdi,vs code etc. fit well to do normal programming work there or  not comfortable?(if anyone  experienced any difficu6 or easiness)

    Thanks




  • 25.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 08:45 AM
    Well - 13" are not so much if you open RDi.

    But to put that into relation - I'm way over 50yo and wearing glasses since some years - so my work environment is a large ultra wide curved display ...

    Daniel




  • 26.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 08:50 AM

    😃

     

    Same to me but I am also using a 13" MacBook Air, when I am on the road.

    For daily work it would not be my choice no. 1 but when I am on the road it is OK.

    You can also connect it with every Screen and Beamer and so on...

     

    If you want it really big use Apple Vision Pro 😃

     

     

     

    Mit freundlichen Grüßen aus der Südwestpfalz

     

    Markus A. Litters

    Geschäftsleitung

     

    E-Mail: mal@mlitters.com

    Web: https://www.mlitters.de

     

    edvberatung.litters | Pfarrgasse 1 | D-66953 Pirmasens

     

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  • 27.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 09:16 AM
    Apple Vision Pro ... yes ... already added to my X-Mas wishlist ...




  • 28.  RE: Regarding IBM I and Apple's laptop

    Posted Sat October 26, 2024 11:41 AM

    I change resolution when using the 13" by itself so things are larger.  Closer to 1200 x 800.   And I wear bifocals. Hooked up to 2 monitors all day long via a dock.

    The 15" Air might be better on the eyes. I have that one as well, but still like the small size of the 13" for travel.

    And I got a 16" USB-C powered monitor for travel.



    ------------------------------
    Richard Schoen
    Owner/President
    MobiGoGo LLC
    Minneapolis MN
    612-315-1745
    ------------------------------